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Stare Master
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Wickham was one of a number of Army leaders who transformed the Army post Vietnam. The M1 and M2 were being developed long before he became CSA, and NTC was in the works before he came in office. DuPuy, Meyer and others were just as instrumental, if not more so, than Wickham. Not a criticism of Gen. Wickham, just trying to rebut the disinformation.
Of course the Pentagon brass don't like Rumsfeld. He canceled the Crusader program. You simply can't square Crusader with the goal of a lighter more deployable force.
As for Shinsecki, my opinion of the little SOB is set. One of those CSA's who helped to transform the Army after Vietnam was Rogers, but don't expect any accolades from me about him.
Only two defining forces have ever offered to die for you, Jesus Christ and the American GI. One died for your soul, the other for your freedom.
"History teaches that when you become indifferent and lose the will to fight someone who has the will to fight will take over." COLONEL BULL SIMONS
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Seasoned Vet
 
Group: Past PNET Supporter
Last Login: 9/7/2005 7:22 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by Opforlt
"Shinseki also ran afoul of Rumsfeld by telling Congress he thought it would take several hundred thousand soldiers to keep the peace in postwar Iraq."
Hmmm, I guess time will tell.
No one at DA likes or respects Rumsfeld, and they say he has no respect for the Army at all.
Gen. Wickham transformed the Army from the post-VN post-draft years to the force it is today. He started the NTC, JRTC, pushed the M1, M2, Humvee, battle-focused training, etc etc. He was also heavily critcized at the time. I wonder what he makes of Rumsfeld. I'll bet he hates him.
I wonder how you guys will view Shinseki ten years from now. Or Rumsfeld.
On the 228th Birthday of the US Army, Rumsfeld doesn't even attend the ceremony for the outgoing CofS. Gen. Keane refused the CofS position, as did Gen. Franks, his deputy Abazaid (SP?), and from what I hear, many others. They simply refused to work with Rumsfeld because they don't respect him, they think he is dangerous to our national interests, and they think his policies will get soldiers killed.
And you guys cheer Rummy on.
Strange.
Well, anyway, happy birthday to the greatest armed force in the history of the world, even if Rummy doesn't respect it. I do. Thank God for the US Army, 228 years ago and today.
Opforlt, I think you get your kicks by being a contrarian and trying to start sh1t here. Shinseki was and is garbage pure and simple. He pushed the wrong priorities, broke govt. procurement laws, and basically made the Army look FUBAR. If you have read this forum for more than 2 days, you will know that the vast majority of members here do not like Klintoon or Shinsuki. Yet, knowing this, you keep trying to act like a lightning rod here. I think you just like the attention.
Personally I don't give a flying "F" if all the service chiefs can't stand Rummy. That just means he is doing his job IMO. I'm sure Rummy's paycheck doesn't have a column on it for 'like pay'.
10 years from now Rummy will be known as the man who transformed the entire US military and won the war on terror. 10 years from now people who be saying 'Shinseki who?, oh that's right, wasn't he that FUBAR clown that was responsible for black berets and the Strike-here?'
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Stare Master
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As we've discussed before Rumsfeld and the DOD staff did not deny CENTCOM any of the troops or units or other assets they requested. That has been confirmed by someone with actual knowledge, although I won't say who in an open forum.
You need to back the hell off. No one here holds a low opinion of the Army, only of self serving officers like Shinsecki. I resent your calling Delta 6 or anyone else on this board unpatriotic.
All of us aware of what it's like to be an infantryman and the importance of the infantry. So you can check the arrogance at the door.
As for Rumsfeld, he served our Country in uniform in WWII. And despite having the ability to make more money in the civilian world he has accepted the challenge of being SecDef twice. The first time was when projects like the M1 and M2 first began. Show me one quote where Rumsfeld has criticized or shown any disrespect to Gen. Shelton or Gen. Keane(who was Rumsfeld's first choice for CSA). The ones who are upset with Rumsfeld are not the warriors but the politicians in uniform who favor boondoggles like the Crusader.[pissd]
Only two defining forces have ever offered to die for you, Jesus Christ and the American GI. One died for your soul, the other for your freedom.
"History teaches that when you become indifferent and lose the will to fight someone who has the will to fight will take over." COLONEL BULL SIMONS
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Regular Joe
Group: Community Supporter
Last Login: 2/14/2008 2:14 PM
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I am going to steal one of Shinseki's statements for business use. Supposedly he said words to the effect, "If you don't like change, how does irrelevance strike you?"
Supposedly Joe Galloway of "We were Soldiers," etc. wrote an article positive towards Shinseki.
Schoomaker seems like a good man and it will be interesting to see what changes he makes. Stryker Brigades disbanded and initial procuremnet distributed to police departments as Surplus?
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Seasoned Vet
Group: Past PNET Supporter
Last Login: 9/7/2005 7:22 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by 509Trooper
As we've discussed before Rumsfeld and the DOD staff did not deny CENTCOM any of the troops or units or other assets they requested. That has been confirmed by someone with actual knowledge, although I won't say who in an open forum.
You need to back the hell off. No one here holds a low opinion of the Army, only of self serving officers like Shinsecki. I resent your calling Delta 6 or anyone else on this board unpatriotic.
All of us aware of what it's like to be an infantryman and the importance of the infantry. So you can check the arrogance at the door.
As for Rumsfeld, he served our Country in uniform in WWII. And despite having the ability to make more money in the civilian world he has accepted the challenge of being SecDef twice. The first time was when projects like the M1 and M2 first began. Show me one quote where Rumsfeld has criticized or shown any disrespect to Gen. Shelton or Gen. Keane(who was Rumsfeld's first choice for CSA). The ones who are upset with Rumsfeld are not the warriors but the politicians in uniform who favor boondoggles like the Crusader.[pissd]
Well "F"ing said Barry!!! HOOAH!![thumbUp][thumbUp]
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Stare Master
Group: Community Supporter
Last Login: Yesterday @ 3:00 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by Opforlt
Delta6 - I don't care what others think about Rummy. I think he is dangerous to us, not the enemy, I think his disrespect of generals in DA is popular with some who think "ivory towers" describes men like Hugh Shelton, Gen. Keane, and others who got where they are because they are warriors, not politicians, and I think his low opinion of the US Army, which you and others appear to share, is unjustified, unpatriotic, and inexcusable. Conventional ground-pounding infantry isn't pretty, or glamorous. But it keeps this nation free.
You damn sure did call a lot of people around here unpatriotic, so back the hell off or move on out. Your information on the "conflict" between comes from published news reports quoting unnamed sources. Yet to you that is gospel. Of course it's not like PBS is biased or anything.[:O] Lord knows they would only report it if it were absolutely true.
After claiming that you are dealing with facts you attribute Gen. Keane's decision not to take the CSA position because of a conflict with Rumsfeld based on what? Nothing but your own bias against the SecDef. Gen. Keane was announced as Rumsfeld's choice last year but withdrew in the last couple of months due to his wife's health problem. Show me one fact that says otherwise.
As for Shinsecki, the laundry list of his refusal to do what is good for the Army is long and documented. Money spent illegally on foreign made black berets for every soldier while units were short of ammunition for training. Delaying a new boot for soldiers which was favored by more than 80% who tested them for no reason other than to review the Uniform Board concept. Insisting on the Stryker as a way to make the Army lighter and more deployable despite the mounds of evidence(reread the pages and pages of information posted on this site with an open mind this time) that it will not be deployed any quicker than what it is supposed to replace. Plus it will be less survivable. After announcing his goal for a lighter more deployable Army he fights for the Crusader, which is the direct opposite of what the Army is suppose to be moving toward.
Your own support for the Stryker boils down to the fact that you personally know the officer so it must be alright. Personally, the fact that you think so highly of this officer doesn't give me any confidence in the Stryker.
One other thing, as far as I'm concerned you are the one that started making personal attacks on other members of this board. You need to go back and read the rules of the board.
Only two defining forces have ever offered to die for you, Jesus Christ and the American GI. One died for your soul, the other for your freedom.
"History teaches that when you become indifferent and lose the will to fight someone who has the will to fight will take over." COLONEL BULL SIMONS
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Strac Trooper
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Last Login: 9/14/2006 9:05 AM
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My 2 year olds watch cartoons on PBS, but even at their tender age, they don't take that stuff too seriously.
Welcome to another Red Devil rehersal, only this time it's for real
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Stare Master
Group: Community Supporter
Last Login: Yesterday @ 3:00 PM
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