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Posted 12/12/2006 4:07 AM


Hard Charger

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In a discussion with my dad over some challenging theological issues dealing with attempting to acheive balance in priorities he made a statement that I've been pondering for the last few days and thought I'd throw it out here for discussion.

“Easy answers rigidly followed make cults.”

There ya go


Profile for skypilot39b

"...my religious belief teaches me to feel as safe in battle as in bed. God has fixed the time for my death. I do not concern myself about that, but to be always ready, no matter when it may overtake me." He added, after a pause, looking me full in the face: "That is the way all men should live, and then all would be equally brave"

General "Stonewall" Jackson

Post #221886
Posted 12/12/2006 6:08 AM
Hard Charger

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I think that is half of it, the other half is the people looking for the easy answers, desperately looking for that branch that reaches into the pool they believe they are drowning in.

That little statement will probably get picked apart, definition of a cult etc. Some will compare the Army to that, but just that statement alone is true whether it is a cult, or any other means to convince a people that you are their slavation, political, religious, or will make their lives better, once you do that, you can influence them to do what you want them to, good or bad.

Post #221894
Posted 12/12/2006 6:09 AM


Masters of Hard Knocks from the University of Gravity

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You are absolutely correct, thus:

THE AIRBORNE CREED

I am an Airborne trooper! A PARATROOPER!

I jump by parachute from any plane in flight. I volunteered to do it, knowing well the hazards of my choice.

I serve in a mighty Airborne Force--famed for deeds in war--renowned for readiness in peace. It is my pledge to uphold its honor and prestige in all I am--in all I do.

I am an elite trooper--a sky trooper--a shock trooper--a spearhead trooper. I blaze the way to far-flung goals--behind, before, above the foe's front line.

I know that I may have to fight without support for days on end. Therefore, I keep mind and body always fit to do my part in any Airborne task. I am self-reliant and unafraid. I shoot true, and march fast and far. I fight hard and excel in every art and artifice of war.

I never fail a fellow trooper. I cherish as a sacred trust the lives of men with whom I serve. Leaders have my fullest loyalty, and those I lead never find me lacking.

I have pride in the Airborne! I never let it down!

In peace, I do not shrink the dullest of duty not protest the toughest training. My weapons and equipment are always combat ready. I am neat of dress--military in courtesy--proper in conduct and behavior.

In battle, I fear no foe's ability, nor under-estimate his prowess, power and guile. I fight him with all my might and skills--ever alert to evade capture or escape a trap. I never surrender, though I be the last.

My goal in peace or war is to succeed in any mission of the day--or die, if needs be, in the try.

I belong to a proud and glorious team--the Airborne, the Army, my Country. I am its chosen pride to fight where others may not go--to serve them well until the final victory.

I am the trooper of the sky! I am my Nation's best! In peace and war I never fail. Anywhere, anytime, in anything--I AM AIRBORNE!


and



The Ranger Creed
Recognizing that I volunteered as a Ranger, fully knowing the hazards of my chosen profession, I will always endeavor to uphold the prestige, honor, and high esprit de corps of my Ranger Regiment.

Acknowledging the fact that a Ranger is a more elite soldier who arrives at the cutting edge of battle by land, sea, or air, I accept the fact that as a Ranger my country expects me to move farther, faster and fight harder than any other soldier.

Never shall I fail my comrades. I will always keep myself mentally alert, physically strong and morally straight and I will shoulder more than my share of the task whatever it may be. One-hundred-percent and then some.

Gallantly will I show the world that I am a specially selected and well-trained soldier. My courtesy to superior officers, neatness of dress and care of equipment shall set the example for others to follow.

Energetically will I meet the enemies of my country. I shall defeat them on the field of battle for I am better trained and will fight with all my might. Surrender is not a Ranger word. I will never leave a fallen comrade to fall into the hands of the enemy and under no circumstances will I ever embarrass my country.

Readily will I display the intestinal fortitude required to fight on to the Ranger objective and complete the mission though I be the lone survivor.

RANGERS LEAD THE WAY!




"Si Vis Pacum Para Bellum"
If you want peace prepare for war!
Post #221895
Posted 12/12/2006 8:02 AM


Regular Joe

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Sorry for the length, but regarding the easy answers portion of the statement:

I don't like theologians. The intent of theology professors seems to be defense of their beliefs based on how they read something. It's like trying to build a skeleton of some animal that no one has ever seen before based on how they think it should look. The dinosaur builders do this all the time using information based on current skeletons. They do their best until some bone they've never seen before gets mixed in with the rest. That where the trouble comes in. You either take the easy road and decide to forget that little bone and pretend it doesn't exist, keeping your pre-existing framework in place and hope that no one ever asks about that little bone again. And hopefully another one never pops up like it.

Or you can try to incorporate that little fragment into the overall structure. This is a little more difficult. They'll look for where that piece makes the least amount of difference and put it there. Or maybe, just maybe, they'll actually think for a moment and contemplate what actually makes sense. They'll try to place it a few different places to see what makes sense before they force their opinions on the world. But more often than not, when they try to incorporate this new tidbit of information, it rearranges their whole framework. And that is much too much work. So what we have is some skeletons with a bunch of strangely placed ribs, tusks, back plates, etc.

So what does paleontology have to do with the Church and cults? If you read the bible and come across some recurring thread, (love God, and show it by loving your neighbor), you have to wonder how we got so many rules (and preachers, don't tell me that they don't "exist" because whether you like it or not, that is how people perceive religion) like God doesn't love gays (a strangely placed nose bone), or God doesn't like smokers and drinkers (a seemingly out of place rib), or that the Republican party is God's chosen (a second head, whoa, how'd that get there).

Cult is a scary word, and it is even more scary when you realize that the Church, or at leas the vast majority of churches I have experienced, operates like one.






I lack people-skills.
Post #221913
Posted 12/12/2006 9:03 AM


Hard Charger

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Danny, I think you hit the nail exactly on the head with how I read the statement.  If we go to the quick easy answers and then do that rigidly, we end up with legalism.  That's why baptists (and I went to one of their seminaries) can't have sex standing up, it looks too much like dancing.

Many of the things that are "rules" are based in good choices for idividuals but then applied to the whole.  Scripture gives us lists of black and white but there is a lot of grey area that I believe we are challenged to evaluate for ourselves given the left and right limits that scripture sets out.  If playing cards is associtated with drinking and smokeing and drinking and someking are a problem for someone and he can't play cards without doing those things then maybe he souldn't play cards, however that does not mean that everyone shouldn't play cards.  (It wasn't that long ago that "good Christians" didn't play cards and in some communities I think that is probably still the case)

The point is that if we have a relationship with God then we are able to work out many of those things ourselves and they are not always the easy answer.


Profile for skypilot39b

"...my religious belief teaches me to feel as safe in battle as in bed. God has fixed the time for my death. I do not concern myself about that, but to be always ready, no matter when it may overtake me." He added, after a pause, looking me full in the face: "That is the way all men should live, and then all would be equally brave"

General "Stonewall" Jackson

Post #221921
Posted 12/12/2006 9:26 AM


Regular Joe

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"Easy answers rigidly followed" translates very closely to absolutes. I'll share what a good friend of mine, Ken, wrote:

I looked it up in the Webster's New World Dictionary and discovered that Black is White. Find the synonyms and you discover that Black = Dark. Dark = Gloomy. Gloomy = Dim. Dim = Vague. Vague = Obscure. Obscure = Faint. Faint = Weak. Weak = Frail. Frail = Delicate. Delicate = Light. Light = Pale. Pale = Whitish. Whitish = White. White = Opposite to black. In fourteen steps truth was turned upside down.

To use one more illustration: Murder is wrong. Abortion is murder. Therefore, abortion is wrong. But . . . Saving a life is right. Protecting the life of a mother is right. Protecting the health of a mother is right. Health includes wellness. Protecting the wellness of a woman is right. Wellness includes emotional health. We should protect the emotional health of women. Tax money should pay to protect the emotional health of all women. We should pay for an abortion if it leads to the emotional wellbeing of a woman.


The point of this? I don't think God expects us to respond in terms of blind absolutes. I think that God wants us to think and respond to each and every situation as it is necessary. I've found that it's much more difficult to operate in a thinking world than run on autopilot.






I lack people-skills.
Post #221922
Posted 12/12/2006 9:29 AM


82nd_Raider

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Answers ARE easy.  Carrying them out is the hard part.

As the discussion brought up the Bible, let me give an example:

Thou shall not kill.

Simple, but look what it takes to follow it.

Cult is derived from culture.  But, it moves in the opposite direction.

All the way, sir!!!

Post #221924
Posted 12/12/2006 11:40 AM


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