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Trooper
 
Group: Past PNET Supporter
Last Login: 10/4/2005 11:53 AM
Posts: 553,
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quote:
Originally posted by PlasticArmyMen
AS for Airborne school and ROTC goes. ROTC does not take away from any slots from enlisted.
If no cadets attended BAC, every slot would go to AD personnel.
Sending ROTC personnel to BAC technically doesn't take slots away from enlisted personnel for each class because those slots were permanently taken away from them when the decision was made to allow cadets at BAC. Spin it any way you want, repeat the line you heard in ROTC, whatever. It doesn't affect the math at all. Five cadets to BAC equals five less slots available for AD.
"You knew the job was dangerous when you took it, Fred." --Superchicken
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Trooper
Group: Past PNET Supporter
Last Login: 10/4/2005 11:53 AM
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Keats, I'm not arguing the pros and cons of BAC for cadets because like it or not our current system allows it. I'm just questioning the logic in the quote from Plastic. That statement didn't originate in his head, it has been told to many cadets and AD personnel in reference to griping about any of the courses cadets are allowed to attend. It's based on semantics rather than the simple reality of the situation.
My personal belief is that BAC should be restricted to those whose MOS could require them to jump into combat, not those who would land at an airhead. I personally see no benefit to having non-Combat Arms MOSs jumping, for example, or anyone whose equipment can't be jumped or LAPESed. Will the potential owner of those shiny wings be distributing LESes during combat from a field table or will he be returning fire and helping to sieze the objective with others who are similarly trained? Will his personal weapon be a typewriter or an assault rifle? If you're not going to jump into the fight, why waste the BAC slot on you?
"You knew the job was dangerous when you took it, Fred." --Superchicken
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Cherry
Group: Registered User
Last Login: 5/4/2004 1:47 PM
Posts: 19,
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quote:
Originally posted by sriley
Keats, I'm not arguing the pros and cons of BAC for cadets because like it or not our current system allows it. I'm just questioning the logic in the quote from Plastic. That statement didn't originate in his head, it has been told to many cadets and AD personnel in reference to griping about any of the courses cadets are allowed to attend. It's based on semantics rather than the simple reality of the situation.
My personal belief is that BAC should be restricted to those whose MOS could require them to jump into combat, not those who would land at an airhead. I personally see no benefit to having non-Combat Arms MOSs jumping, for example, or anyone whose equipment can't be jumped or LAPESed. Will the potential owner of those shiny wings be distributing LESes during combat from a field table or will he be returning fire and helping to sieze the objective with others who are similarly trained? Will his personal weapon be a typewriter or an assault rifle? If you're not going to jump into the fight, why waste the BAC slot on you?
If the Army is basically going to send every officer that wants to attend BAC, it is better off for the Army to send them as cadets.
1. They live in barracks, eat in chow hall.
2. No TDY as a 2LT or 1LT.
3. Get hurt and the cadet foots the bill. (This happened to me before I completed Jump Week)
4. Get really F'd up, the Army will have no obligation to care for you for life.
In June 1988, we had almost 400 soldiers and cadets in D Co. By Wednesday of the 1st week, we were down to ~ 250. Slots are not the problem, people getting slots and quitting or falling out of runs is the problem.
Open for suggestions.
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Trooper
Group: Past PNET Supporter
Last Login: 10/4/2005 11:53 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by Keats
and LESes are meals?
Leave and Earnings Statement, basically the military's version of a pay stub.
quote:
they have upped the number of total slots available.
Still a game of semantics. Justify it any way you want, but less than 100% of the BAC slots go to AD soldiers, therefore cadets take slots that could be used by AD soldiers. Easy, isn't it?
quote:
I would much rather jump out of planes than go to school all summer.
So would I.
"You knew the job was dangerous when you took it, Fred." --Superchicken
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Hard Charger
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quote:
Originally posted by Sh0t
LAPES is the system of of a c-130 or such, coming down to ground level, the hatch opens up and a parachute pulls the pallet out of the aircraft where it skids along the ground. Low altitude parachute exit system I think.
LES = leave and earnings statement
E = Extraction. Everything else, good to go.
http://www.parachutehistory.com/military/lapes.html
"EBO isn't a strategy. It's a sales pitch." - Ralph Peters
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Regular Joe
Group: Registered User
Last Login: 1/23/2006 8:04 PM
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keats, sriley,
I would have to agree with you on the point of only sending those to bac who really need it for their MOS. I too don't see the point in sending anyone to BAC when their job doesn't require it. In cadetland its a toss in the air. We don't know right off from day one if we are going to need to have wings or not b/c of the way we are selected into each branch. But CaptainCaveman has a good point too. It would make better sense to send cadets rather than officers b/c it costs less in the long run. We don't get paid, we eat what they give us, and we stay where they want us to stay. Plus they haven't sunk enough money into us (At least not as much as an LT) to the point where if we get really F'd up as he put it, they don't lose a lot of money when we get medically discharged. Pretty cheap if you compare.
"Lets kick this pig"
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OIF Veteran
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Abn vs. AAsslt:
www.paratrooper.net/aotw/commo/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=726
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Hard Charger
Group: Registered User
Last Login: 12/21/2008 7:24 PM
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I am sure at the time LT Beavers wanted to be an infantry officer.
Of course he could always apply for a branch transfer.But the Army needs good people in the TC as well as the other branches.
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